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VAT De-registration - Final Return

Hello, we de-registered for VAT on 7th Sept 2014 (confirmed by HMRC) - mid quarter
We submitted the return with the normal quarter end dates (but included just the VAT reg period data) but the submission failed
We tried again using just the vat reg periods, but quickfile suggested this is not a valid quarter- use month end
So we tried that and the communication failed
Is there any solution to this or do we use the government gateway directly?

I think when you register for VAT mid period you need to manually run the first return via the government gateway as Quickfile only works within some pre-defined return period settings.

I would assume this would also apply to de-registration so yes, your last return will need doing manually via the government gateway.

The rejection is coming from HMRC rather than our system. Even if you deregister mid quarter HMRC still expect you to send a full quarter return over the electronic gateway. I’m not sure if the Gov Gateway works any differently to that?

If you contact HMRC VAT helpline they should be able to clarify this.

Glenn I think you are mistaken. HMRC does not expect to send you full quarter return for your final vat return but rather a return up to the deregistration date.

I just submitted a vat return which was a final return after deregistration. The period to submit was 1st Feb 2015 to 27th Feb 2015. This return was due by 3rd April 2015.

I initially submitted via Qf for the period 1st Feb 15 to 28th feb 15. ( I could not select 1st Feb 15 to 30th April 15 as 30th April 15 is in future) QF accepted the dates and I was able to hit the submit button. However it was rejected by HMRC and QF returned it as unsuccessful and not filed. So I changed the date in Qf to 1st Feb 15 to 27th Feb 15. Qf did not let me hit submit button and the error message from Qf was ‘end of the month date is needed to submit a vat return’. Due to lack of time I decided to file it on hmrc’s website and just mark it as filed on Qf.

I suppose if Qf had allowed me to use 27th feb 15 then it might have gone through?

I’ve referred this to a developer. If there’s an end date restriction we will remove it.

Thanks for all the responses.
To clarify, HMRC wouldn’t accept the full qtr return, but QF would allow it through.
QF suggested end of month, but HMRC did not accept.
HMRC only want the return for the specific reduced dates, but QF won’t allow to be submitted.
I have filed the return on government gateway, and “submitted” the VAT return in QF after turning off the “file return with HMRC” tick box.
I would suggest that QF needs a “de-reg” date within the system, just like it has a “reg date”. So rather than turning VAT registration off and on, it’s registration is date bound instead. But I would imagine this is low volume demand, so the work-around above could be referenced in a “de-reg” help section?

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Thanks for the update @dckeaney. We will shortly allow users to submit with any start and end dates they wish, although admittedly a little late in your case.

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So will there be a “deregistration” date box in the vat settings Glenn, I’m going to need to do this with my next return :slight_smile:

Not a de-registration box, just more flexibility with the end date. Previously it would only restrict you to providing a month-end date for the close of the period.

Hi Glenn

Has this been implemented? I ask because i have a final vat return to submit for a VAT deregistration dated 19/20th August. I am planning to get it done next week.

Thanks
Sameera

We removed the validation on the dates, so yes it should allow you to put any dates you like in there now. Just ensure that HMRC are expecting the same period you supply in QF, we have no way of knowing this.

okay, thanks Glenn.
I will let you know how it goes.

hi Glenn, i have just submitted a FINAL vat return for the period 1 Aug - 19 Aug.
it has been rejected by HMRC. I am on the phone to ask what is the issue.

their email says that it failed HMRC data checks.

if you want to look at the vat return then its QF a/c 6131446133

The reason they provided was:

The VAT Period you have entered 2015-08 for the VRN --------- was not found, please check and resubmit if necessary.

This means the month end you have supplied them with is not what they were expecting.

The guy at VAT online helpdesk said that there might be a communication problem with the software.

if you look under the rolled back VAT returns, you will see the following message

HMRC Responses for VAT Return

Response Date Response
28/08/2015 10:35:16 By ChRIS : The VAT Period you have entered 2015-08 for the VRN xxxxxxx was not found, please check and resubmit if necessary.

the guy said , based on this response it looks like HMRC is not reading the dates from QF.

Also one other observation. The last VAT return, the period on HMRC system is called FINAL
Whilst the one i submitted on 31st July 2015 (for the same client), the period reads 07 15

Do you think this could be the issue?

Thanks

As per HMRC, the dates should be 1st Aug to 19th Aug. These are the ones i used.

Screen shot to confirm the periods

No I don’t believe this can be the problem, as we only send a period ID, in your case 2015-08, we do not send a start date to HMRC. Instead they lookup the period ID and determine what the actual date range should be.

What they’re saying is they didn’t expect a period ID of 2015-08 but something else. If you speak to HMRC again ask them exactly what period ID they expect to be filed next, this is the key piece of information you need.

okay, will do thanks

Its taking long to get through to HMRC. so still on the phone.

in the meantime please see these screen shots. under column period, for the final return the period is FINAL. I feel this is the period ID they are expecting. what do you think?